I noticed the there a 2 different DB prefixes with the database, not sure where that came from but backup restore to different server reintegrate new prefixes?
Mystery resolved and I have no idea who the DB got so messed up...as mentioned the prefix did not match the DB prefix...strange how it would still work, that is when I discovered that the real prefix was 3 pages back the db had over 500 tables.
sure enough there were the users back in page 3 with the correct prefix. search all the non correct prefixes and dropped the tables. now down to 178 tables woohoo
This would explain why I was getting login error when trying to update from Joomla 3.8.10 to 3.8.11 it was looking at the wrong login info or most likely taking the first one it came across
Crossing finger all appears to working correctly.